Here’s where the Eli Manning/Alex Smith comparison might not work
Look, we all know that Eli Manning, the new postseason god, and Alex Smith, the continuing big bust, are very different QBs, very different people, living very different NFL lives for two very different franchises.
New York Giants. 49ers. VERY DIFFERENT franchises.
But it’s human and sports nature to look at Eli’s Super Bowl run with the Giants and think:
* If Manning, the 2004 No. 1 pick, can rise up from three-plus years of bust-like performances, isn’t it possible that Smith could too?
* Or, at the very least, shouldn’t 49ers fans give Smith another year–2008 will be Smith’s fourth NFL season–to show that he can play solid QB in this league?
I’d generally agree with the patience thing. Hey, even before Eli’s surge I was all for picking Smith over Mike Nolan in that face off, so you know I think Smith is worth something. Probably.
I seriously doubt Smith will ever be as good as Manning was in those Four Fateful Playoff Victories, but Smith shouldn’t be thrown away, either, even if that’s what Nolan and Mike Martz are planning (and I think they are, sort of).
But there’s one biii-iig problem with the Manning/Smith comparable and I’d forgotten it until John Clayton’s excellent Eli column today:
* Eli hurt his shoulder–slight separation, hmm, why does that sound familiar?–and, though there were reports that he could be out for a long time, he stayed in there and gutted it out for his team, basically establishing himself as a leader right then and there.
We can safetly generalize that Alex did no such thing during his shoulder separation, which, granted, might’ve and probably was a lot more serious than Eli’s.
But here’s the illustrative excerpt from Clayton’s piece, which referenced Tom Coughlin’s feelings for and patience with Manning:
“The reward for Coughlin’s confidence came early in the 2007 season. In the opening loss at the Dallas Cowboys, Manning suffered a mild right shoulder separation. He missed a couple days of practice but continued to play. “I knew it wasn’t bad,” Manning said. “I threw after I hurt it in the Dallas game. I said, ‘Hey, just give me some days and let me do everything I can to get this thing well.’ I didn’t want to miss a game. I want to be out there if I could help the team.”For a couple of weeks, Manning had to adjust because of the injury.
“Yeah, it was sore for the next couple of weeks,” Manning said. “During practice, any time we had a deep throw, I couldn’t make the throw, I’d kind of say, ‘Hey, I would have thrown it to the post, but I’d take the 5-yard checkdown.’ Probably after three or four weeks, it felt fine. I was able to make all of the throws. I don’t think it affected me as the season went on.”
–(here’s the link to Clayton, though I think it’s a pay-article so this might not help you)… Back to me…
I certainly don’t want to knife Smith for being careful with his shoulder, especially since I was urging him to shut it down from the outset of the late-Sept injury.
(Mostly I was urging it because I could see it was bugging him and that it was fruitless to keep sending him out there. Nolan disagreed with me, obviously.)
The problem: Nolan wanted Smith to act like Manning–gut it out, show his teammates leadership, prove that he has the necessary QB intangibles.
Manning need to show that after three bad seasons, after the huge trade in 2004, the No. 1 pick, all the money, all that. In New York, Manning definitely needed to show that.
Nolan thought it was time for Smith, who has his own leadership issues, to show that kind of temperament.
Smith wasn’t ready to show that–I thought that was clear and I thought Nolan shouldn’t have pushed it. But he did push it.
And when Nolan didn’t see Smith step up (again, nobody knows what pain Smith was in except Smith and Smith believes the 49ers training staff made it worse, so keep that all in mind)… Nolan torpedoed Smith to the team.
There will be fall-out from this thing for a long time, I don’t care what Nolan and Smith try to say. Of course, it’d be nice if Smith said anything at all, but he has been ducking everybody for a long time.
Again, that’s not something the New Eli would’ve done. Eli gives us strange facial expressions and looks mopey a lot, but he hasn’t ducked anything in his four years in NY.
Smith is ducking a lot of things right now and he didn’t pass his Nolan-shoulder test in October and November.
I think Nolan more than anybody else is noticing that right now.
alex smith needs to learn how to perfect longer passes more instead of playing safe (rolling out and throwing for 3 yards). i also think 49ers need more oustanding WRs like plaxico and amani.
Couglin is not some defensive coordinator who never led a winning team in any area of football. (HS, pop warner, Nfl, college, jr college) The teams who we coached senior bowls with tampa and tenesee are in the playoffs. AS the worst team in the NFL we got Smith, the year before the worst team got Eli Manning, guess who just won the superbowl? We now are giving the superbowl losers who just one 18 straight, our top 10 pick. Am i the only one who sees a problem with this picture? Our grand poobah Jethro York has turned our playofff team with Maruicci (after we lost steve young)
into the worst team in the NFL for the last 5 years.
Think coaching doesnt make a difference? tell that to NY fans and Warriors fans.
When Smith throws great passes, niner receivers drop them.
When Manning threw a horrible pass into triple coverage with the game depending upon success, his receiver made a miraculous off-the-helmet catch.
Incomparable situations.
Niner
You’re wrong, the team with the worst record in the NFL in the last 5 years is: The Oakland Raiders.
Niners should go after Chad Johnson (Vernon would have to give up #85 though) and see what Alex Smith is capable of…
i don’t see how you can call 3 years with 23 or more TD passes bust-like performance or compare eli with alex smith. i know it was smith’s rookie year but 1 TD to 11 INTs is pretty awful. point being, while eli may throw too many INTs, he has always thrown more TDs than INTs which smith never has, and clearly has the poise that smith lacks. i agree that they should be patient with smith because he’s still very young, not even 24 yet. i’ve always liked him and i hope he ends up doing well, mike martz can’t hurt, but he’s clearly not going to be a super bowl winning quarterback for a while.
Where is the Sean Hill article Tim? I’ve been looking every few hours since they signed him. I still can’t believe their saying its a competition..what??? This is a guy we took number 1 overall…the reason he hasn’t shown up yet is because they switch offensive cordinators every 30 seconds…and the wide recievers on this team are horrible. How would Eli do with the wideouts poor Alex has to work with.
Fire Nolan…fire the owners. We want Carmen and Eddie!
I can’t wait for late summer when the baseball teams are the worst in their leagues and the two worst football teams in the last 5 years dominate the local sports scene. Wow.
Alex Smith had a shoulder injury that required surgery, and he didn’t pass the leadership test by toughing it out? Ridiculous! I’ll wait and see what Mad Mike can do with him. Hopefully, we’ll finally see that Smith was worth the #1 pick. If not, we’re probably in for years more of futility.
Mad Mike will probaly do what he did in Detroit. Drop the overrated high draft pick and go with the weak armed cheap veteran. I have no idea what kind of player Smith is and have no idea what direction the Niner’s are going in. It was a once GREAT dynasty and organization that has now been reduced to a clusterfudge of in-fighting and mediocrity. My only solace in all this turmoil is that “Hey, at least we’re not the Raiders.” Hahahahahaha
The shoulder separations are not the same. Smith’s needed surgery and Eli’s did not so you cannot compare them. For Nolan to expect the same shows the he (and you) can’t manage QBs. If Smith needed surgery then he shouldn’t have played and he needed surgery.
Not a good comparison, for several reasons: 1) Tim’s premise pre-supposes that both QB’s were equal to begin with. Manning had a better pedigree, better collegiate career, and at draft time was actually in demand via trade. Smith was only the best QB in a bad draft; the 49ers couldn’t give that draft pick away. 2) Manning had a MUCH better first 3 years in the NFL, 3) obviously Smith’s injury was considerably more severe, and 4) Manning has no reason to be uncommunicative. After the Nolan brush-up after the disagreement over the health of his shoulder, I suspect that Smith is operating under a virtual gag order. What can he say at this point that will not fuel the feud and ruin what’s left of his 49er career.
Better college career? Alex Smith went undefeated and led Utah to a blowout in a BCS Bowl game. Eli Manning didn’t sniff the BCS. Trade interests? The only reason Eli generated trade interest was because he demanded it by refusing to play for San Diego.
Didn’t Smith gut it out (whatever that means) for several weeks before finally shutting it down?
TJ’s comment is spot on! Manning threw an absolute garbage pass with the game on the line. But fate was on his side. The receiver made a miraculous catch off his helmet in triple coverage. Manning is a hero, Superbowl MVP. But more likely he would have been the goat, with his crapola pass shown on highlight reels ad nauseum. Not that any of this applies to Smith, as he hasn’t gotten anywhere near a game that matters yet. But it would be nice if Smith played for a team with a defensive line like the Giants, they were the real MVPs, and with them Smith might get to that game that matters.
Mr. Mully: Eli Manning’s collegiate career included over 10,000 career passing yards, 81 TD’s, and a 137.7 QB rating. He won the Maxwell Award and the Johnny Unitas Golden Arm Award and he was the concensus #1 draft pick. He also played in a pro-set offense. As I understand it San Diego refused pre-draft trade offers, but did in fact trade him after he refused to play for them. They received in trade Phillip Rivers (#4 that year), a 3rd rounder that year and New York’s 1st & 5th round picks in 2005. It seems that somebody was interested in trading for him. Alex Smith, on the other hand, stayed at Utah for only 3 years and started only in his junior year. He had a brilliant year in a gimmick offense and Utah went undefeated. However, many draft experts had him rated behind Aaron Rodgers as the best QB in that draft. Almost nobody felt either of them was worthy of the #1 spot. Braylon Edwards was more often rated #1, though there was no concensus #1 that year. Aaron Rodgers slipped to #24 and many felt that could/should have been Smith’s rightful spot. Look at the first round results for that year and you won’t find many success stories - it was a weak draft.
#15: Instead of giving Alex Smith a “kick in the butt,” let’s say we give him some offensive linemen who can block (more Baas, less Smiley, Jennings, Heitmann, etc.) and throw in some WRs who can hold onto the ball (Bye-bye DJack). Then, if we can get VD not to jump offsides every game — sometimes on the very first play — perhaps Alex would get a chance to get some rhythm going. Just a thought.
Please understand–I am NOT a big Alex Smith fan. But in all fairness, to me it seems as though everyone has been missing the point since Day 1 that Smith stepped on the turf. Alex Smith suffers from the same syndrome that Joey Harrington did in Detroit–a highly paid #1 pick to whom has been given the responsibility of saving the franchise with a bunch of mediocre to inferior players in all other positions with the exception of punter and (possibly) place kicker. We all saw what happened to Joey’s confidence and career. The best way I can explain this phenomenon is this: It’s hard to complete a pass when you’re laying on your a** (fill in your consonant of choice). Enough already–start Hill and draft some frigging linemen to protect him. Bye bye, Jonas, it was great not seeing you play and steal money from the idiot owners of this once great and now pathetic franchise.