The Others
Chris Mullin has already promised changes for the off-season. Only time will tell whether his statement turns out to be this year’s version of “I’m not trading Jason Richardson.” Ultimately, however, change for change’s sake does nothing, particularly if it’s just rearranging pieces in the back third of the roster (as we saw last year in all moves following the Wright trade). The Warriors still have lots of holes. The following players, however, are pegs that aren’t likely to fit.
Al Harrington - I had a tough time putting Al on this list, but his play at the end of the season left me little choice. He grew increasingly inconsistent when the Warriors were in desperate need of a bench scorer. He would be active for a quarter, then disappear for the next few games. When he’s hot — hitting threes, going to the basket with purpose, scrapping for rebounds — he’s an ideal piece in Nelson’s system. Unfortunately, he was that player far too infrequently this year. The fatigue excuse doesn’t work given the minutes he was playing (as a reader correctly pointed out after I thoughtlessly pulled that card for him once this season). The out-of-position excuse also doesn’t work particularly well since it’s unclear how Al would have played differently against small forwards than power forwards or centers. Arguably, the change of position would have simply eliminated his biggest strength this year: excellent defense on some larger, less mobile players. Offensively, he still would have been shooting jumpers and getting bogged down on half-hearted attempts towards the basket.
There’s not a nicer player on the team than Al and he seems to be supremely well liked by his teammates. Unfortunately, it’s unclear where he fits into next year’s plans. Wright is not a center, unless Stern’s next CBA caps players’ weights at 240. If Wright improves this off-season as much as I believe he is capable of doing, he will demand serious minutes at the 4 next year. If the Warriors manage to obtain a hustle / bruising power forward as many fans hope, that further cuts into the minutes at the spot. Andris, sitting on a fat new contract and a steadily increasing body of skills, isn’t about to give up minutes at center. Kosta might even sneak a few more against bigger bodies. At small forward, Jackson will continue to play 30+ minutes a night, not to mention spill over minutes from Azubuike and Belinelli should Nelson decide to go small. Long story short, Al looks to be the odd man out if the Warriors are more committed to developing their (no longer rookie) young talent rather than simply trying to wring wins from the bodies of veterans. He’s not a bad player to have around, but won’t play anywhere close to the minutes needed to justify his $9.2 mil salary. It wouldn’t shock me at all if Al were this year’s winner of the Jason Richardson memorial “dumped for cap reasons” award. It’s unlikely that any of the teams under the cap would want Harrington or his deal, but Mullin might be able to find a team willing to swap one or two 08-09 expiring deals to save the $10 mil will owe Harrington in 09-10. Progress? Only for Cohan’s accountant.
Mickael Pietrus - Watching MP wait for a contract may be one of the more entertaining / sad distractions this off-season. He vastly over-valued his worth on the open market last year, finally finding himself forced to accept the Ws’ qualifying offer. He spent roughly 9/10ths of the Warriors season doing very little, including a crucial stretch during our playoff push modeling pastel sweaters from the bench. Unlike some lucky players, he failed to time the 1/10th of the season when he actually delivered so as to earn a big contract (looking at you, Austin Croshere, with that famed Finals performance). Pietrus, like a long line of athletically gifted and mentally or motivationally challenged players before him, continues to show just enough potential every so often to keep people mildly interested. In the economics of today’s NBA, mild interest doesn’t translate to $5 mil a year. It might equal $3 mil a year, depending on the way the contract winds blow, and if I was MP’s agent I’d sign that contract before it could cool from the mouth of a laser printer.
There’s some distant chance that MP might be back next year with the Warriors if he finds no other takers, but I can’t see him returning to play under Nelson given the ups and downs experienced this year and the quality players ahead of him in the depth chart. MP actually impressed me with his late-season stint at power forward (he grabbed more rebounds there than Al), but MP’s rotation spot with the Warriors has proven to be a dead end. He may find success somewhere else, but I’m guessing Pietrus will find the out of bounds lines on his new court just as east to step back upon as those at the Arena.
Matt Barnes - While the Warriors may be the last option for Pietrus, they could still be a good home for Matt Barnes. Both players faced similar contract situations last year and failed to convince the rest of the NBA that they were anything but tricks of Nellie’s system. If Barnes lacked negotiating strength last summer, his play this year wiped out what little leverage he may have possessed. Still, despite how bad Barnes looked this year at times, I’m optimistic he still could be a contributor here.
Barnes obviously suffered a tremendous loss with the passing of his mother at the beginning on the season. He pushed hard to come back soon but never quite seemed to be able to put the pieces together. Barnes, despite his seemingly wild play on the court, worked his way into the NBA with discipline. He completely rebuilt his shot the off-season before he joined the Warriors. Last year, he was one of the most devoted followers of Nellie’s master plan, always pushing the ball and looking for that forward pass, even when it was ill-advised. When he took the court this year, that discipline seemed to have broken down, sadly reducing him on a few occasions to nothing more than a flagrant fouler. He’s a player that was built to thrive in Nellie’s system, as we saw a year ago. It’s my hope that with some time away from the game, Barnes can regain that drive and fire that made him such a huge part of the Warriors’ playoff push in 06-07. We’ve lamented Richardson’s absence from this year’s team, but in terms of ball movement, defense, rebounding and three point shooting, Barnes’ disappearance likely had an equal or greater impact. My guess is the team would gladly take him back on a near minimum deal. I’m also guessing Barnes would like more than that. We’ll wait and see whether he gets it.
CJ Watson - Watson is another player that could theoretically fit with the Warriors. The question becomes, however, whether he’s worth the roster spot. I presume the Warriors will either draft or sign a back-up point guard again this off-season, as they attempted to do last year with Troy Hudson. I’d give Watson an edge over most second rounders, but I’d rather give a first rounder or free agent a chance to run the second squad. Still, Watson’s price tag is likely to be reasonable, so I wouldn’t be shocked to find him on the summer league team and in camp next fall.
In terms of Watson’s play on the court, I’ll give him an incomplete. He had some nice all-around games, showing quickness on defense and a smooth shot. He rarely made mistakes that hurt the team. The flipside of that, however, was that he rarely did much to make his teammates better. He proved adequate at getting the ball from the endline to the top of the arc at the other end, but once asked to quarterback the team in a set offense, he didn’t do much. He gets an incomplete because he never managed the consistent minutes to show what he could do. Watson didn’t do a bad job. The Warriors simply can do better at the back-up PG slot.
Austin Croshere - For the vet minimum, Croshere was a deal. That said, prorating his salary over 44 rather than 82 games, he becomes much less of a bargain. The story here is entirely about injuries. Austin’s skills - three point shooting, rebounding, general savvy veteran play - are perfect fits for the Warriors’ system. Bad backs, however, rarely get better with age. The Warriors could use a player they can rely on for more than half a season of basketball. Depending on how the Warriors’ off-season shapes up, it might be worth bringing Austin back again just to have another veteran on the team. This year, however, the young guys will be a year older and less in need of veteran supervision (and maybe the youngsters should have been supervising Baron at his birthday bash). Croshere’s return to this team will likely come down to (1) whether he wants to come back and (2) whether the Warriors find someone in the summer league or training camp that makes enough of an impression to trump the quality 10 minutes the Warriors can count on from Austin 30-40 times a season.
Patrick O’Bryant - Every decade needs its own Todd Fuller.
Chris Webber - Assistant coach? Part owner? The man inside inflatable Thunder? After the jaw-dropping improbability of his return this year, I’m not ruling anything out. (I made up all of the above options, by the way. This is how nasty rumors get started.)
When you combine this post and the last, here’s how we look heading into the off-season:
Here to stay:
Ellis
Biedrins
Wright
Belinelli
Jackson
Likely to stay:
Davis
Harrington
Azubuike
Perovic
Back for the right price:
Barnes
Croshere
Watson
Happy trails:
Pietrus
O’Bryant
Even if you slice the spots a bit differently, the Warriors are likely to have 5 or 6 open lockers in the months to come. It’ll make for an entertaining off-season of moves (or a painful off-season of non-moves). While the rest of the NBA entertains itself with the playoffs, we’ll have plenty of time to break down (to sub-atomic bits) all of the options.
I’m with you on Harrington. Can’t believe I’m saying this but I’d prefer Pietrus to Barnes. I hope Watson comes back. I’d love to see POB stay but they didn’t exercise his cheap option and there’s no chance he’d choose to stay unless Nellie departs. Watch him flourish somewhere else.
In the last post you said something about how if Wright gains 30 pounds he might lose some of what makes him special… I disagree. When someone puts on 30 pounds of muscle, they get more mobile- increase body control, and jumping ability. NBA players are not lifting like professional body builders, they have trainers, they work on their core strength and they create long limber muscles. Muscle will help him, and he is at the perfect age to do it.
As far as Barnes- I agree with you, if he can play like how he played last year he is perfect. A real hustle defense player that can push the ball and even play Point Forward. He really is the best playmaker off of the bench. And he can shoot the 3 too, (he just didnt do it all season). Don’t expect any offers from other teams after that horrible season.
Al Harrington- i think what he brings to the warriors is very valuable. Wheather its worth his contract is Mully’s job to decide- but just from a talent perspective, I think Al would make a really great 6th or 7th man. Remember, we are trying to cut down on the starters’ minutes!
Pietrus, a few great games doesn’t negate the fact that this guy has the Bbal IQ of a parisian streetballer. cmon dude, how many times was baron yelling at him to get the hell away when he had a good matchup, oh yeah, and he likes to catch the ball out of bounds for some reason.
Croshere? I’d rather have Al Harrington.
Bruising power forward? why did we get rid of Lasme again?!
I agree with everything except I would put Buike in the “Back for the right price” group. With all the money we are gonna give Monta, Biedrins, and possibly Baron… I just don’t think he’s “Likely to stay”. Great blog by the way, good stuff.
Todd Fuller got more than his chance… POB never did. If we have picked up his option, we might have been able to trade him for something at the trading deadline instead of letting him walk for nothing now.
I agree about Harrington.
Remember what everyone said about AH during training camp including Nellie. He was slimmer, dominating 3 on 3 games, making hooks shots with both hands. It didn’t work out this year, which probably means it’s never going to work for AH here, with or without Nellie, regardless of the position he plays.
I doubt he’s valuable enough to trade for an impact player in return, so here are a few options.
He could be traded to Memphis for Jason Collins’ expiring contract and a backup for Baron like Kyle Lowery.
Or to New Jersey for Stromile Swift’s expiring contract plus filler.
Or to NY for Malik Rose’s expiring contract and Renaldo Balkman, but Donnie Walsh already traded AH.
Philadelphia might use him, as they have virtually no scoring from the 3 or 4 spot.
I’m just throwing spaghetti at the wall; hoping one of these deals can stick. None of them may make the team better immediately, BUT they do clear cap space for the 2009 FAs and clear the way for more minutes for BW. We’re not winning the championship next year anyway. I think Baron will re-sign with the Ws, so the cap space is necessary to sign a FA in summer 2009.
If you don’t like hearing about cap space, you might have to get used to it. Nellie just mentioned it again the other day.
2009 FAs: Brand, Wilcox, Drew Gooden, Odom, Marion, Carl Landry, Paul Millsap, Brandon Bass, James Jones…
Good list for the most part but I do have an issue with one statement you made.
“We’ve lamented Richardson’s absence from this year’s team, but in terms of ball movement, defense, rebounding and three point shooting, Barnes’ disappearance likely had an equal or greater impact.”
Barnes’ absence had an equal or GREATER impact than JRich last year? I think that comment somewhat marginalizes JRichs’ value to our team. Barnes was a great story last year and was an awesome spark plug to get us going BUT JRich, after recovering from the injury, was our most reliable and consistant player, 3pnt shooting and rebounding included. When you include his heart and his emotional investment in the Warriors (only one to be here during the Dark Ages) I think his value and the effects of his absence far exceeded any fall off from Barnes game. Still miss watching that guy play, salary cap be damned.
There should be a law against what Nelson and the W management did to POB, a #9 pick deserves a chance, either with this team or another. Either play him or trade him to someone that will. The kid deserved a chance to play.
To keep him and not give him any real chance borders on immoral. It’s just wrong.
Ditto trading JR for BW. After all those years of futility, and finally making a playoff run, just wrong to trade JR then.
Mullin knows that these things are wrong but defers to Nelson, who to me has absolutely no conscience in regards to how he treats players, pawns for the king to use as he sees fit.
Adam,
If the W’s get rid of the names mentioned above, I think Nelson will want to go to a 3 man rotation and sit 12. “I know I can play, but you see my bench is no good. I’m going to only play 3 on the court.”
And you know who Mullin was talking to I think in saying “we’ll keep them” regarding Monta and AB. None other than his cheapskate owner Cohan. They forced Mullin to trade JR, Nelson and Cohan, specifically for the reason of signing AB and Monta. Everything Mullin has done in past years has been a player and salary dump, all for his summer when the money needs to be spent, not squandered.
Mullin is saying he intends to do it and it’s not open for a cheap owner to discuss if he wants Mullin in the job.
“There should be a law against what Nelson and the W management did to POB”
Cry me a frikkin river. Warriors management paid the kid over 2 million dollars last year to basically sit on the bench or play practice basketball. That’s a crime I would LOVE to fall victim to. He got unlucky with a new system being brought in just after he was drafted. He’s 7-feet tall, someone will give him a chance so no need to shed tears over the poor 21 year old millionaire, if he’s any good, he’ll have his chance.
I agree with Mr Mully. You earn your way onto the court by playing well in practice or the D league. Sounds like he didn’t impress in either.
Well it certainly can’t be anything close to more of the same for next year. Lots of posters continue to insist that a tweak here, a minor trade there, and the “core” will have what it takes to really impress. Don’t think so.
The whole concept is wrong. The quality of play of the good playoff teams–Utah, Lakers, Hornets, Spurs, Mavs, Suns, Celtics–is just so far beyond what we saw with the Warriors this year that the entire enterprise needs to be rethought.
Biggest obstacle is the Baron Davis situation. No other club is likely to tender him a better deal than he’d get here next year. Mullin is unlikely to extend his deal. So we’ll be stuck with a majorly pissed off point guard next year whose skills at that position are sorely lacking.
Gotta wonder what Mullin was thinking trying so hard to get Al Harrington. He knew Al in Indiana and tried desperately to sign him as a free agent, then finally traded for him. And look what we got. A marginal bench player. Jackson, for all his personal charm, cannot contribute enough from the small forward position to justify his bad shooting, invisible rebounding, killer turnovers, and bad decision making in general.
Keep an eye of Jose Calderon during the playoffs and imagine him in a Warrior’s uniform.
Invest everything in Monta and Andris, give major minutes to Brandan and Belli, sign a force at PF, and let the rest fall where it may. Give that group sufficient time to develop. Then maybe we’ll have something beyond the Fools’ Gold the We Believe crowd fell for.
Pau Gasol: How great he looks. The Lakers have tremendous on-court chemistry now. He’s the difference maker for them. BTW, what really good team does NOT have a substantial inside game?
Remember: five posts maximum per person to keep the mental viruses at a minimum.
If there was any guy I was hoping to improve last season that was Al. I think he is not as comfortable playing multiple positions. He will do good on a team which will use him only as SF if they can live with the fact that he is too slow to guard SFs.
We need MB, CJWatson and ACro come back as third string forward, guard and center if we can get them for minimum.
Adam:
Since everything the dubs do for next year will depend on the BD ETO, the relevant First Question would appear to be When is the deadline for his opt out decision? Second Question would be whether dubs will renegotiate his contract into more years(more money guaranteed)like 3 years/40 mill starting at about 12 mill. The suspense will be unbearable.
Some team is going to offer Azubuike 5yr/25 mill starting at about 4 mill per—will that team be the dubs?
James Online: I would just like to note that you and I have fundamentally different views of how the Warriors should proceed. I feel as if you vastly underrate the abilities of Jackson and Baron and have made them the primary (or only) scapegoats for the Warriors’ failings over the last two years while simultaneously giving them almost none of the credit for the team’s successes.
I personally don’t believe a long-term core of BWright/Belinelli/Biedrins/Monta will have a better chance of winning a championship against Oden/Aldridge/Roy, Durant/Green/Beasley or Rose/Sonics’ 6 first-round picks, the CP3-led Hornets, and other teams than a “win-now” core next year of Jackson/Baron/whomever the W’s can acquire by trading their young talent (which is at its highest value point right now) for a veteran inside presence and attempting to shift slightly toward a more half-court philosophy while still allowing Baron and Jackson degrees of freedom.
Again, I don’t ask you or the other “win-later” fans to agree with me, all I ask is that you respect my opinion as a legitimate alternative for the Warriors, and not dismiss it as ideas of someone who should “find another team,” like someone else has done previously.
I will continue to support the W’s whichever philosophy they choose, but my main hope is that they move strongly toward either the “now” or “later” philosophy and not attempt to mix and match the two, which I see as a prescription for never-ending 4-8 seeds and no championships throughout the future.
In retrospect Harrington was probably the key to making or not making the playoffs. His inconsistent play definately hurt the cause. We sure could use a few role defenders (ie Bruce Bowen). So whoever goes some of the replacements need to be able to D up.
MP
Pietrus was quoted after the Suns game that his first choice was to return as a Warrior and that he actually liked playing for Nellie. Maybe a contract ploy, but actually that doesn’t make sense. Obviously any team that wants Pietrus will be able to sign him away from the W’s, but IMO its better than 50% that he returns.
POB - always the lightning rod.
He didn’t get the QO this year because of what happened with Pietrus last year. Signing a player for trade bait only works if you can find a good trade. At this point, O’Bryant might only yield a player that played more, and showed less.
I don’t think the Warriors owed him anything other than a paycheck, but as a fan, you want to see all your guys get a chance. I don’t expect him back, but would be neither shocked nor horrified if he did return.
I agree that either Barnes or Pietrus are likely to go, with MP being closest to the door. I’d probably lump them together as “back at the right price”, with that proviso. Croshere and Watson are a different situation because we know they’re minimum contract guys. It’s not such much their prices as everybody else’s.
POB
He falls into the category that we can’t argue what we don’t see. THe word on him has been that its not necessarily his poor talent hurting him, just his lack of focus and inconsistency that he has shown “consistently” in practice.
But, if we don’t know for sure, lets blame it on Nelson. WHen you earn $2 Mill per year, why show effort and focus if you think your coach may not play you. Maybe next year will expose the truth once and for all.
AH
I hope he works out, but not too optimistic. He is the one guy that you see, and say ” I could hang out with that guy”.
I simply think that the lack of good “bigs” put him into a position of filling a position just too big for his talent. Another good big man, a slightly smaller role, and he could become a top tier player.
Adam–thanks again for a year of diligent and thought-provoking coverage of our Dubs. ‘Preciate it!
In retrospect, this past year has been a transitional one in terms of personnel and competitive identity for this team. Most placed an undue amount of “best case scenario” perspective on the team assembled at the start of the season and were rewarded with seeing just how shallow that composition was.
Whether this was due to a failing of Nelson’s “development” of our youngsters, reliance on injury-laden free agent signings, or individuals going through contract extension or personal angst, we gambled on having sufficient back-up for our starters to support our breakneck style of play and crapped out in the final third of the season.
Dre and Monta’s extensions bump our 2008/9 eight-man rotation# (i.e. assumptive of 16Mil/annum for the two and the 6Mil still owed to Adonal) salary figure at ~61Mil. Per that, the questions in bold on that should be on Flat-top’s whiteboard:
*from a financial perspective, how does this roster get filled-out with significant pieces with roughly (and only) mid-level type money to spend?
*from personnel and forward-thinking perspectives, what price do we pay in breaking up the current core and getting more competitive in the West?
(#BD/Monta/Jax/AH/Dre/BWright/Marco/Kosta)
As much as I like the guys as individuals, we had no consistency off the bench. Watson was OK, but if we’re keeping Monta, we need a bigger point guard. Croshere couldn’t stay healthy,(bye), as much as Pietrus came on at the end he was nowhere for a long time,(bye), if Barnes can ignite his spark without the flagrant fouls I’ll take him at minimum wage. What we get in return for AH doesn’t measure up to helping much. I still see him here, coming off the bench for spurts of hustle minutes. I didn’t see much of Perovic to make a difference other than size. Still, I understand those that are calling for a revamping of the whole team just to be able to compete. I’m hoping for some cohesion from Mullin, Nelson, and Cohan to make the right choices and get this team to the next level. The playoffs just aren’t the same this year without us.
Just check out Al Harrington’s numbers compared to former whipping boy Troy Murphy. Oh yeah, Murphy was better in nearly every category particularly rebounding. And they both play awful defense. Harrington was our SECOND HIGHEST PAID player. The reason we missed the play-offs.
POB in the D League? Yeah 24 points, 14 rebounds and 7 blocks in a game isn’t impressive. He couldn’t have played 12 minutes as a backup for a team with no rebounding and little shot blocking? Better than Webber? Please. It was year 2 for a 21 year old 7 footer who was a top 10 pick. Just watch him with another team. Todd Fuller? You need your head examined.
Baron is not opting out and giving up 17.8 million (that is the real number despite what you read), Monta, Andris, Jack, Bellinelli, Wright and Kosta will all be back. Kelenna is restricted too. He will be back.
No chance on Barnes, very slight chance on Pietrus if he’s really cheap.
Harrington, the 10 million trade exception and the 14th pick are the chips to trade. Need a backup point guard (Earl Watson) and a banger/athlete (Chris Wilcox). That trade with Seattle is too easy and makes too much sense.
# 11. A core of Jackson, Baron and Ellis (or a strong but not superlative new pf) just does not stand up to the core groups of the better teams now in the playoffs. Does Baron make the other players better, particularly at crunch time? Does Jackson do more for a team than a good 4th or 5th man on a good team? Ellis, compared to the winners, is a very good player but can’t yet carry the team for many nights. So you’d have to grade our present core on the “B” scale, not likely to bring us progress from where we are. We’ve got some cash and possibilities, so the key is to tweak this core to move it up to B+. This will probably entail trading some or at least one of the present core, My concern, like James Online and Oracle, and others, is the influence Nelson, who is very bright, but has too many hangups to change his ways. When you see the elite teams moving the ball and getting good shots, remembering how Nelson allowed the playground 3sto keep clanging, its painful. I’m sure he (Nelson) had his reasons, maybe to keep the adulation of Jackson and Davis, but no matter how much they loved him, they couldn’t get us where we needed to go. So management has to step in and make some changes, and Nelson will need to adapt, or fade into oblivion. Thanks Don for what you’ve done for us, but we need to keep moving forward.
If the Warriors get lucky enough to draft Kevin Love, he will be the bruiser we need, and Nelson would play him next year. Since it’s unlikely that Love will fall to us, hopefully we’ll get a physically strong power forward by trade, so that Nelson will have the choice of Wright or said bruiser at power forward.
But none of the scenarios that we posters come up with will come to pass, so it’s pointless to try. Mullin/Nelson will pull the trigger in some unexpected way out of the blue, and then we’ll argue about it.
One missing piece—
We have no way of knowing of a major-impact event like no Nellie or no BD, so a lot of the speculation is just wasted breath. Dubs children must wait patiently—waaaahhhhhh!
But this draft is PF heavy and my wasted guess is that the dubs will have their pick of one of the top 3 PF for about 1.7 mill. Someone IS going to make sure this rookie plays.
Wilson(#20),
I was hoping Ws get Reggie Evans at the start of the season as he fits into bruising power forwards you mentioned.
But in Nelson system, Ws need a PF who is a good outside shooter and also gets rebounds(a poor man Dirk like Charlie Villanueva). If we get a bruising power forward with no jumpshooting ability, he will probably play as backup to AB at center. Given that AB can’t shoot(yet anyway), playing two guys with no jump shooting ability is not a good idea, in Nellie’s system or not.
These Others are interchangeable with any other NBA regulars, only the miraculous arrival of a superstar will improve the Warriors fortunes from merely praying to make the playoffs.
Michael Wilbon out it this way: The Washington Wizards were reminded, rather rudely Monday night, of the enormous difference between an all-star and a superstar. The Wizards have three all-stars but put together they don’t come close to equaling the one transcendent iconic player Cleveland has in LeBron James. Yes, in NBA math three can be less than one.
If BD does opt out of his contract I see a team like Miami making an offer for him. They are desperate for an elite PG to add to DWade and Marion, and it looks like they’ll have the necessary cap space to do it. Pat Riley is not into player development only instant gratification.
I’m also concerned because missing the playoffs should not put the team in panic mode. We had a pretty good year with a nice core that just needs a ton of help from the bench.
I also do not think that BW will be ready to start at PF next year, although he should be getting steady minutes at the 4 and even the 5 (when Nelly goes small). Despite what others may feel I didn’t think that we needed to acquire an elite PF a la Garnett or Gasol to get to the next level; someone like a Brandon Bass, Jason Maxiell or Paul Millsap would have suited just fine. Pair BW with a bruising, hustling PF who doesn’t mind doing the grunt work, and trade AH for a backup PG and forward (unless we could somehow get our mitts on Elton Brand).
My player predictions for the summer:
Baron - doesn’t opt out, doesn’t get extension. Mully has him under microscope yet again.
Monta - Mully forced to match offer sheet tendered by Memphis to keep him @ around $9 - $10mil per.
Andris - resigned to $7 - $8 mil per, less than Monta but with more years (5-6)
Jack - staying
AH - traded
Pietrus - gone via free agency
Barnes - hits gym this summer, resigned for vets minimum.
POB - never got to squeeze the Charmin
Kelenna - resigned @ $3 - 4$mil per to backup SG and SF spots. Nelson still loves him.
Belinelli - if he can play both guard positions…
BW - still a little too light in the rump.
Perovic - Nelly under pressure to give him more PT
Austin - thanks for everything
CJ Watson - summer league and a camp invite.
Draft pick #14: please no more picks based on potential. Kevin Love is my favorite which is why they’ll draft another guard.
Thanks again, Adam. I may not post all of the time but I always read…
Draft probability:
Chances the W’s hit the lottery at #14 are approximately -
#1 - 0.5 % (1 in 200)
#2 - 0.6 % (1 in 169)
#3 - 0.7 % (1 in 139)
Assuming 2008 is the same as other years. After the first pick, the odds vary based on who got the pick. The best possible odds of the W’s getting a 1, 2, or 3 pick is ~ 2% (1 in 50). That occurs if the #1 and #2 spots are won by the #1 and #2 teams.
#10
“Invest everything in Monta and Andris, give major minutes to Brandan and Belli, sign a force at PF, and let the rest fall where it may.”
You make it sound like forces at PF are a dime a dozen and with this core (everyone of them has a glaring limitation), a stud/all-world PF would be needed to legitimately compete for a ring.
Bucky - I must have missed someone’s post who suggested you “find another team” but all I can say as an outside observer, is to me you are one of the “backbone” posters in this community and as I consider all the serious posts here I always look for and value yours.
I would put myself in the win later camp because I don’t see this team improving much as curently constituted. BD has huge skills but if he opted out, that money could buy some valuable pieces.
In a post several days ago Dr_John (sp?) suggested that this team won’t grow to an elite level until at least one of the core players (ME or AB?) is traded. It is going to have to happen.
I’m not sure if your ownership/management is willing to take that risk because from what I can see, Oracle is selling out and I’m guessing most of the fans will be happy (and renew their season tickets) if the dubs get the 8th seed next year.
I have never understood the rational for bringing nellie back for one last year and I especially don’t understand the reason for extending his contract so early. I’m not pro or con as far as nellie goes.
The up tempo game is gaining popularity across the league because it’s fun for te casual fan and also it can be effective. Ultimatly, teams made adjustments for Walsh’s West Coast offense and it’s effectiveness due to it’s novelty waned. It was and is an effective offensive option and it and it’s varietys are still being used. Having said that, just having a WCO doesn’t guarantee a winning season any more then an up tempo offensive scheme will.
Defense is 50% of the game and as we watch the playoffs I believe it will become clear that the Warriors lack of defensive consistency is a major flaw and unforgivable flaw.
It’s going to be a fantasticly interesting off season, almostas interesting as the last month of the season was.
#30,
“It’s going to be a fantasticly interesting off season, almostas interesting as the last month of the season was.”
Last month of season was depressing more than interesting for Ws fan, hopefully that will not be the case in the off season.
It became clear (during the MP I-want-out thing and the non-use of the bench at the last fourth of the season) that Nelson thinks there are currently only 8 NBA-quality rotation players on the team right now.
And two of those are marginal rotation players in MP and Harrington. I don’t see the W’s getting anything much for either of those guys, I don’t see CJ and Barnes and Croshere sitting at the end of the bench next year being nice guys.
Baron, Monta, Jackson, Biedrins, KA, Wright and Bellinelli will stay. Maybe Perovic. But I think the W’s will shake it up and send a message. I’d be surprised to see any of the others on the roster at the start of next year.
Everybody knows Baron Davis would love to play for the Lakers. With the talk of Lamar Odom becoming expendable when Bynum comes back, can any sense be made of a Baron for Odom trade? Assuming he’s OK physically, Elton Brand would be a great addition. Problem is Baron won’t likely find takers elsewhere (though the Miami suggestion was a good one), so our hands are tied for spending after Monta and Andris are locked up.
I thought the whole season was depressing. Bad basketball has never been “fun” for me.
“With improved perimeter defense and shooting as the goal, (Rod)Thorn is likely to target a number of cost-effective free agents this summer, including unrestricteds such as Keyon Dooling, Matt Barnes, Mickael Pietrus, Trevor Ariza, Kelenna Azubuike and Eduardo Najera, and a possible opt-out such as James Jones.” — The Star-Ledger
Three Warriors on the New Jersey Nets radar. Didn’t know our boys had such high demand.
Watch Utah play if you want to see a good team. Watch their defense. There is a reason the W’s can’t beat them. They are well coached. They play tough. They play smart. They play together. I’m impressed.
I’ve heard low carb diets are a good way to lose weight. Maybe BW should do the reverse and get on a high carb diet this summer
POB played a position of EXTREME need for the W’s and brought skills we really needed: low post scoring, blocking, rebounding, low post defense. He showed in games he deserved a chance, and in D league that he deserved a chance. What team drafts a player #9 and never gives him a chance and he’s healthy? Only the W’s. He is young and he is a big man. A double whammy for this coach.
POB got screwed because Nelson doesn’t value bigs and the skills they bring (rebounding, low post scoring, low post defending) but only ball handling and perimeter shooting. If they weren’t going to give him a chance, they should have traded him. Yes he got 2m, but so did AB and now he’s looking at 8-10m per year. What is POB looking at?
Is AB really more skilled than POB. POB has better low post scoring, can shoot from short range, blocks shots etc. AB has the advantage of getting to play and develop. Where would POB be with 2 years of 30 mpg playing time?
You will all be shocked if POB does get his chance that he is a good player and how stupid Nelson is and his small ball anti-big mentality when you see him develop for someone else.
Count BW also in the category of a top 10 pick big man that screwed by having Nelson for his coach. His development has been delayed also. Hopefully he gets his chance next year even if Nelson returns.
And please tell me why we brought Kosta over and paid him $2m. He has less skills than POB and BW that Nelson looks for, so what is he doing here getting jerked around.
I bet Bell wishes he had stayed in Italy one more year.
Mark my words, the W’s have closed the door on European players as long as Nelson is coach. They have closed the door on bigs. They have closed the door on rookies. Those are 3 areas we need to develop, and NOBODY in those categories (European, bigs, rookies) wants to play for this coach.
Pbob, I think that for practical purposes you can add the probabilities to get 0.018 as the likelihood of getting one of the first three, or 1 in 56, close to what you wrote, but it doesn’t depend on who gets the first two picks.
But I’m not a mathematician.
I don’t really get all this love and support for POB. Every time I saw him on the court he looked lost, disinterested, w/ no passion. At best I see him as a serviceable back up center (kind of like the Collins twins) but I don’t see the next great low post scorer that everyone else seems Nelson destroyed.
So you guys are telling me to hold off on ordering that BEASLEY “They City” jersey?
My bad, The City. Blew that layup.
I think what POB really needed was 2 more years in college, maybe on a more big time team. He’s only played for a few years, and is not very instinctive (or confident) on the court.
He may be back in the NBA next year, but he probably won’t make more than 2M and it could be a lot less. He has proven he can play at the NBDL level, so I’m sure he’ll continue to play somewhere.
Wyatt, u just pulled a Rasheed, so unlike you.
Nelson loved to throw Brandan, Marco, POB, and even Kosta out there at surprising times toward the end of the season to get the “Oh, wow, do you believe what our creative coach is doing” reaction with no intention to build on what they did in future games or nurture their development generally.
POB looks slow in every respect. He seems overwhelmed by the situation, extremely foul prone, and just sort of goofy. The jury is still out on Kosta. He looks slow too, and has yet to show that jump shot from 8-12 that Barnett talks about. He deserves a chance to play, but I don’t have much hope.
For those who doubt Andris, wake up! He is one of the most awesome big men in the league already despite the erratic playing time and shoddy treatment in general from Nelson. Doesn’t have a jump shot? No, but his game is expanding and if he can just be effective from a bit farther out he’ll be even better. With a Power Forward that has more range, Andris’ deficiency in this area won’t matter. Does Dwight Howard have a jump shot?
The secret to Brandan Wright’s development is to stop thinking of him as a Power Forward, but instead as a small forward or just plain “extremely talented basketball player.” We were robbed this year by not seeing him and Bellinelli get the time on the court they needed to develop.
Nelson is in a “win it all now for Me” mode that undermines everything the Warriors should be doing.
BW is a tweener as far as PF/SF goes, probably best utilized as a wingman that fills the lane. Neither he nor Andris appear to have much range, which limits their potential as a C/PF tandem. If Perovic’s rumored mid-range J shows up then you could really put small ball to rest with those 3 up front. I’m all for that as long as the W’s don’t stop running. AB and BW are bigs made for breaking, Kosta not so much, but he can just hang back and enjoy the show ala Foyle. Harrington still fits in with this group, by stretching the D, as hopefully can Marco, though he may need another year. And you still have Baron and Monta (of course) running the show. Maybe Monta can teach Baron the value of the mid-range J (likely). Then you add Beasley– okay, sorry back to reality– Darrell Arthur(who Nellie would sit) or (cringe) Joe Alexander/Chase Budinger and you’re competing for that 8th spot again . . . barely.
POB was a Montgomery draftee. He and Ike Diagou were supposed to be the next big men in the eternal search by the Ws. In his first two years he moved in and out of the D league, was a known for being a project, questioned about his lack of toughness and, seemingly, desire, since his work ethic was in serious question. Between last year and this year, he supposedly put in a lot of extra work and was mentioned again, in the context of this being his last chance, as a possible player after all. So his status has had some big clouds over it.
All of the rest of what has been mentioned is true, as well. He really just became another victim of the Nellie small ball mentality. I have never been a big fan of his because he seems not get a lot of things, yet he did show signs of improvement this year and that was the word on the street.
As for comparing him with AB, I think it has been obvious all along that AB was more active, more willing to mix it up and learned faster. The fact that he takes shots that he can make at a 60% clip just shows that he knows his limitations and makes the best of them. I have always liked Biedrins, even when he was a raw rookie who fouled all the time. He is just more of a gamer. He has that quality of confidence that he can play but still knows he has to work his way up the ladder. Now he has paid his dues and is developing into a really good center. He may not be the center that some people want, but he gets things done and is definitely part of the solution here, not the problem.
POB may yet find his place in the league, if for no other reason than there are mighty few big men out there who are more than stiffs at center. He certainly hasn’t had a real chance here and will never get it. He needs to go somewhere where he can take a real shot at doing what he does well and build up his confidence and his body a bit more. He is still a project, but he doesn’t need to be in a place where he will always be looking over his shoulder every time he violates “one of the cardinal rules,” as Nellie is wont to say about his youngster’s mistakes.
Speaking of which; as for the 800 pound gorilla, he is still here.
#33… you thought the whole season was depressing. Then move to Miami or Memphis and cheer up.
#35 POB showed he deserved a chance? Huh? Do you even watch the games? Blah, blah blah. ChuckieC, the dead horse beater in chief, has returned.
A couple of other things.
Yes, everyone should be looking at the playoffs to see the whole spectrum of the wacky and wonderful NBA
Check out the “playoff officiating.” Doesn’t exist? Wow. Get some pads for these guys. This IS a different game.
Along with silly uniforms, the Wizards are just being thugs to make up for their lack of ability. Pathetic on both counts. If I were on that team and I was forced to wear those uni’s, I would try to get traded.
76ers, for at least one game, see where they may be headed thanks to developing their rooks and youngsters.
Houston, playing even more shorthanded way past the Yao injury, are ground up by Utah. As has been mentioned above, Utah is a team built for the playoffs. No huge stars, but team defense and offense and a good BENCH, some of whom were rookies last year. You may not like their pace at times, but this is what it takes to be a post season contender. Jerry Sloan can coach.
Suns and Spurs: Wow. Two different styles battling it out with big names on the court. First round series that is final round quality. If Spurs win it will be because of defense.
Denver will prove that money doesn’t buy everything, again. Where is KM?
Much more….
We were going to be in this mix? Not for long. Go home, get some rest.
Ever thought of trading straight up +/- Baron Davis and Al Harrington for Chris Kaman and Corey Maggette of the Clippers? That would surely address our Power Forward and instant offense in CMaggette problem.
Considering that Corey has been unhappy with the Clippers for quite sometime the trade may have an appeal.
POB showed more talent, more size, more skill, than AB did at the same stage of his development under coach Montgomery. If you remember AB starting out, he was the definition of raw. The difference is Montgomery gave him a chance to play and develop, and POB never got the same chance. Say what you want about Montgomery, but college coaches know they have to develop their young inexperienced but talented players because they know they need them in a couple years to be ready as players leave. Montgomery did the work to prepare both AB and Monta to succeed by giving them PT early in their careers. Monta looked good from the start. AB did not.
AB struggled early. He got into foul trouble early. He got pushed around early. He didn’t look big enough, or strong enough, to compete in the NBA. He had no post up moves, and no range on his shot. Really, worse skills than POB. Many of the same things people are saying about POB also were said, and worse, about AB in his first couple of years. The difference is AB got to play in those early years, under a college coach that knows the value of developing young players.
POB got a coach that doesn’t want to develop young inexperienced players, especially bigs, at this stage of his career because they make mistakes, look bad, don’t fit his offense anyway, and the coach knows he won’t be here to personally benefit from their long term development.
POB can do more things now than AB could do early in his career. He has some range on his shot. Has a low post hook shot. Is a better shot blocker. And he also has many of the weaknesses that AB had early too in size and strength. AB is quicker. POB more skilled and a better shooter. All things considered, POB does have potential and should have been given the chance to play back up minutes and develop. Ditto BW. Ditto Bell.
#47
Hey Oracle,
I agree with a lot of what you say but I don’t agree with the POB skill set. He may be able to shoot from father away better and he is certainly taller for blocking shots, but he just doesn’t put the energy into his game that AB does. Having skills and using them are two different things.
I don’t want to argue with you about this because we agree on 90% of it, but AB has qualities that POB doesn’t have and may never have, and both coaches saw them. I’m sure much of the reason AB got more playing time was because he worked harder and understood the game better. That was common knowledge at the time.
I feel sorry for all the young Ws who have languished on the bench. I also feel sorry for AH for having to play center and MB and MP for having to play PF and center. I’m sorry we don’t have a defense or the right type of players to compete for a championship. I’m really sorry that the 800 pound gorilla is still in the room. That is why I AM TIRED.
Nose for the ball and the bouncy quality of his footwork and passing is what separates Andris from POB, Kosta, and most centers in the league. Andris plays like Dennis Rodman. That’s the best comparison. Plus he scores the ball. Instinct, attitude, quickness. That’s Andris. Not POB by any stretch of the imagination.
Players that see the court and instinctively know what to do win me over. See any John Havlicek video. Watch Bellinelli in the future, assuming he doesn’t figure out a way to get back to Italy where I think he feels he belongs.
When I see the Sixers I am reminded of how much damage this Warriors team could do in the East bracket.
Last year, most of us wanted Nelson, we got Nelson and have seen his work this year and now we know that we need another coach to move forward. Unfortunately, we might have Nelson one more year and the worse part is that Mullin can not control Nelson without losing his job first.
I am fairly sure that Cohan is not that unhappy because this year profits were pretty good from tickets and TV.
Unless there is something major, we might have another season a bit worse than the one that we got this year.
We are not saying that POB definitely will be a star or even a better than average center. We don’t know, neither does anyone here, and neither does Nelson, because he didn’t get a chance. To spend $6M or so on Perovic but to pass on an option costing only around $1.5M seems unintelligent to me, and I suspect it was part of the salary cap paranoia for re-signing Monta and Andris. Penny wise and pound foolish. If POB develops into a decent player, that’s something else I’ll be mad at Nelson for.
#50
James,
Very well said.
Hey fellows:
Nelson and Mullin won’t solve their problems trhough the draft!
But there are some useful, reasonably-priced free agents this year (besides Croshere, Barnes &c.), including:
Primoz Brezec
Maurice Evans
Lorenzen Wright
Kenyon Dooling
Jake Voskuhl
Fred Jones
Francisco Elson
Eddie House
Devin Brown
DeSagna Diop
Darrell Armstrong
Chuck Hayes
Chris Duhon
Casey Jacobsen
Carlos Arroyo
Bostjan Nachbar
Bonzi Wells
Beno Udrih
Anthony Carter
Also, if my post (Keepers #10) is in any way accurate, some teams will be re-shuffling. I think that Dallas, Denver, Chicago, and maybe Houston will be looking to unload some folks. I like:
Luol Deng
JR Smith
Carl Landry
Eduardo Najera
Jerry Stackhouse
Ben Gordon
Andres Nocioni
(I don’t like Devean George, though)
Miami has to cut deals with Ricky Davis, Shawn Marion, Jason Williams and Dorrell Wright. Perhaps a trade or outright pick-up here.
Opt-out players may include:
Emeka Okeafor
Andre Iguodala
Jennaro Pargo
James Posey
Elton/Corey/Gilbert/Artest
maybe Rip…
Some nice pieces, no?
Pardon my brain virus but:
One reason I like KP is that he actually has a big body that could be developed further. It does make a difference and we need one. He also can rebound, shoot and block shots. He seems to be around the ball and I did see him make some switches on defense, for what that is worth. OK, he is a bit slow, but he kept up in the times I have seen him play, I don’t know about the money issues, but that is always a problem with this organization, one way or another. We either pay too much or too little, it seems.
Again, as with POB, we know nothing much about his real potential because we haven’t seen much of him either. He did do rather well in the infamous “short roster” game where Nellie emptied the bench, except for Marco (!?!), and the subs showed a lot of potential, especially BW. Just another footnote to a strange season.
Oh well, back to being tired.
#55
Nice list. I’m going to check it out. Thanks!
Couldn’t we have had Bonzi Wells for the stretch run this year? Seems to me we could have. That might have changed things a bit.
49 Tired
“I feel sorry for all the young Ws who have languished on the bench. I also feel sorry for AH for having to play center and MB and MP for having to play PF and center.”
I don’t feel sorry for any of these guys. AH is getting over 9 Million
Dollars to play basketball. MB & MP could not be counted on a consistent basis. Ask any of the young Ws, if anyone should feel sorry for them.
Guys the same age going to Iraq, that’s who you should feel sorry for.
Holy man
Geez, I was just using an expression for this context. Believe me, I don’t feel all THAT sorry for them in the ultimate sense. I’m sure you can get the drift. It IS rather sorry that so many people heap blame on some of these people when all they were trying to do was what they were told to do.
Don’t get me started on Iraq and the worst administration this country has ever had.
If Baron opts out for an extension w/ the Warriors we should make his contract incentive-laden. Will start his salary at $8mil/year. If he avgs. 9assists/game then give him a mil bonus. 10assists, give him another 2mil. So on and so on.
If he gets avgs. 20 and 10 plus 5boards and 2.5steals then he can get his $17mil salary.
Jackson needs to get stripped of his “captain” status and become a role player. He needs to take less than 13 shots a game and less than six 3s a game. He needs to avg. 15pts a game and 5boards while keeping the best player on the other team to a low fg percentage.
AH, just needs to stop thinking too much on the offensive side. He stops himself more than the defender.
Five to six vacant lockers for the W’s? Thank you Adam.
Above ALL else, MONEY matters, most especially to the W’s Cheap Executive Officer Chris Cohan. Nobody can argue about that.
How sweet it is to day dream (again) about our next years draft, possible trade and so on. I could see Mr. Mullin with his wide open eyes sinking very deep in their sockets. Poor Chris Mullin. His boss glaring at him while Mullin tries to mule on his future. Should Mullin make a trade or not? I mean, how should Mullin handle THAT detente between Baron and Nelson. What a dilemma!
What if Nelson decided not to come back?
I hope Mullin has learned enough not to do THOSE same mistakes again (on Dunleavy, Murphy, JRich and Foyle signings).
And can Mullin handle this coming draft without a replay of Chris Taft,Ike Diogu, POB and KP?
Who are the available cheapy veterans out there? Do I see another dysfunctional W’s team next year? Five to six slots to fill is a lot for a team. The problem is, exceptional basketball players don’t come in cheap! Just my thoughts.
Oh yes, thank you coach Nelson for giving us 48 wins but I still prefer to see a SOLID Warriors team playing a serious game of basketball.
Tired
Fair enough.
You’re right about the administration, but the kids I feel sorry for.
Don’t get me wrong. I love AB. For all the reason people posted and more. I’d take AB in a heartbeat over POB right now. I’m just saying AB got a chance and POB, despite some skills better than AB, did not.
I think if you take a player #9, you owe it to your franchise to give that player every opportunity, on the court, to develop and become a player for your franchise.
Did Mullin and staff make a horrendous mistake picking a kid #9 that had absolutely no talent and no business being in the NBA? I didn’t see that when I saw him play. Raw. Yes. So bad you could clearly see he would never make it with some PT development. I didn’t see that.
Or was POB more a victim of a coach that undervalues bigs and in recent years refuses to give young inexperienced players any PT?
How often do you get a #9? Don’t you owe it to the franchise to see what that #9 can do, on the court, before you lose that pick and don’t get anything in return?
He showed enough skills to see what he could do. I don’t think Mullin made a terrible mistake. I think Nelson stubbornly refused to give him a chance.
Tired,
I agree with you on this admiinstration, although I hear some way back when may have been worse. Worst in my lifetime at least.
Somewhere in Texas, a village is missing it’s idiot
Re: the debate about POB. Wilson is right and I’ll add to his point. POB played effectively in most of the opportunities he got this season, including, of course, the NBDL. Given the Dubs needs inside and the skills POB showed, its fair to say he wasn’t given a fair shake. The writing was on the wall after the Clippers game where POB played great. What did the team do? Sign Mbenga the next day, play him, and banish POB to the end of the bench.
Tired and James Online may be right about POB in that he does come across as a Joe Barely Cares type in his limited body of work. But this year he was an improved player from training camp on. If he becomes a stud for another team, the horse beating will carry on into perpetuity.
Dr. John at #24: “But this draft is PF heavy and my wasted guess is that the dubs will have their pick of one of the top 3 PF for about 1.7 mill. Someone IS going to make sure this rookie plays.”
Unless the Dubs beat the long odds and get a ping pong bounce that will land them Beasley, is there a power forward in the draft that will surpass Brendan Wright in talent and potential? I doubt it. Hence, the Dubs should work for trade.
Last summer I suggested here on several occasions that the Dubs trade for Gasol. Many rejected the idea suggesting that he wouldn’t be a good fit or he would cost too much. Now look. The question is, who is the next Pau out there that is attainable. I think its Elton Brand.
Playing GM is like playing high stakes poker:
If you believe your best players can get you to the finals, keep them and try to add a final piece: Pistons with R Wallace, Bulls the 2nd time with Rodman,
Rockets the 2nd time with Drexler.
Do you really think BD, SJax ME & AB can be
a serious contender with another card (piece)?
If so, try to get that final piece, using your trade exception, 08 Draft pick, BW & MBell and whatever else it takes.
The Dubs did this with the Webber trade and seemed to be on their way for a while.
The Celtics did this last summer, and they have at best 3 years to go for a title run before they will have to rebuilt.
The Lakers have been sucessful for a long time because they will always take a chance to get a impact player. They rolled the dice to get Bynum, the Dubs took the safe pick in Ike. They took a chance with the trade of CButler for KBrown and came out smelling like roses when they used KBrown’s
expiring contract to get Gasol.
Another way to go is do what Portland did, keep your best young players and trade away everyone else, and get lucky with Oden.
You could tank a season when a great player will be in the draft, but you need luck:
The Spurs and Celtics both tanked the year
Duncan came out and the Spurs lucked out despite the Celtics having 2 lottery picks.
The worse situation to be in is to be good enough for 8th or 9th seed,but not bad enough to have enough balls in the lottery.
Of course if you do get the first pick in the draft and take the safe pick like a certain team did in ‘95………..
Actually, the Clippers game is a great example of how hard it is to evaluate a player. POB successfully altered shots on 2 straight Clipper possessions. Both times, his man (Kaman) went right to the hoop, collected the garbage, and flushed it down.
I haven’t seen these plays since they happened, and even if I had, I’m not sure I could tell you whether Patrick did the right thing or not. Under the circumstances, I think he needed to help out, but he probably committed too soon, releasing Kaman early.
When I’ve seen POB play, he’s shown he can expend a lot of energy on defense, but is often out of position. On offense, he often comes across as passive and lacking in confidence.
I wouldn’t call drafting him a ‘horrendous mistake’. Plenty of high picks don’t work out. This is particularly true with centers. Foyle was an 8th pick. How many centers has Seattle drafted in the 1st round? Diop, who was the 8 pick in 2001, played last year for 2.1M and is now a UFA.
I looked at some of the profiles on draftexpress.com, and it was not entirely encouraging for next year. There are several PFs on the 1st round mock, but they all suffer from the usual flaws in their game, limited skill sets, and/or lack of athleticism. It sure would be nice to get someone who can really add something as a rookie, but it’s more likely to come from our 2nd year and more players.
Re: the draft. Someone has to be tough enough to keep Nelson from his own worst instincts. Often he looks for the unusual player, a 7′ 2′ African native that can shoot 3s, even Bellinelli, a hot shooter with an Italian accent, its all part of the Nelson persona to want to be known as the unconventional “genius”. And sometimes it works and he gets someone overlooked by the more conventional minds. But how about looking at the list of the top 3 rebounders in each of the strong college conferences, the D-league, and the European leagues, and try to get the most NBA- ready of the lot. Is this too meat-and potatoes. Isn’t that what Sloan did in drafting Boozer. Isn’t past performance one of the best predictors of the future? And I am also beginning to question the motivation for trading JR for BW and money. If Nelson doesn’t develop his bench because he wants to win now with his best men, why does he trade JR who could help now for a skinny kid who is a few years away from making an impact. it seems inconsistent. Was he overruled and didn’t want to trade JR, or did he think BW would make a difference this year, or were there other reasons for not playing his bench. I don’t know, it just isn’t logical.
I’m sorry but I just have to get Al out of here. His play and court IQ absolutely horrified me.
I’d hate for the Warriors to start making trades just to shake things up but I honestly don’t think that’s what they are looking to do.
However, I think Mullin has become a bit more savvy in his managing ways and will be able to structure a team that can work for Nellie in more ways than one.
For us to go farther next year, we need to have a bench. That is more key than adding more firepower to the starting line. The bench provides the kick that gets us through the season.
#63 & #65
Just to finish this up. It is a BBall forum after all.
Holy man
I feel WAY SORRY for the people who have gone and those who died in Iraq. There is no comparison or doubt about that. It is a shameful situation. That a bunch of cowards who never served themselves could send young people to die so that they could get rich and stay in power is a crime beyond mortal punishment. May God have mercy on their souls. Or not.
Oracle
You are right about some previous Presidents back when, but I think this administration ranks as the worst of all time because the stakes are so much higher now and we should learn from the past, not repeat it. So the stupidity level is much higher. The level of corruption, ignorance, graft, greed, indifference to suffering and lying is also a new high, or low.
70 Royk
Manute Bol:
Drafted by the Washington Bullets in the 2nd round (7th pick, 31st overall) of the 1985 NBA draft.
Carlos Boozer, signed as a free agent in 2004 after two seasons with the Cavs.
How about Dirk Nowitski drafted 9th in 1998 by DN ?
MB may or may not make it , hard to write him off after one season.
Ownership was behind the JR trade, they did not want to pay the tax.
Many things with the GSW and NBA are not logical.
69, agree some top 10 picks don’t work out, but how many top 10 picks that are not hurt never get a chance to succeed or fail on the court?
This franchise owed it to POB and to itself to see what he had, on the court, before letting him go. It failed POB and it failed the fans and the team by wasting a #9 pick without ever seeing what he could do on the court. It’s one thing to see a player fail. It’s another to not even give him a chance.
Ok Tired,
You got me there.
This is the worst President and administration in the history of the USA.
Clinton gets impeached for lying about a bj.
Bush lies about WMD and gets 1000’s of fine young americans killed, costs us billions of dollars in an unnecessary war and the dems don’t have the balls to impeach.
Which lie was worse? Which cost the USA more in dollars and in world respect and in the loss of american lives?
Nice energy policy btw. Let the oil companies make the USA’s energy policy behind closed doors. They know what they’re doing. Result = Record oil and gas prices. Record oil company profits. No serious attempts to develop alternative energy sources. That worked. Not.
Hey, and lets throw out the genevea convention and torture prisoners of war. Excuse me, we’ll just call them enemy combatants instead of POW’s so we can torture them because everyone knows it’s wrong to torture prisoners of war. Its ok apparently if we just call them something different. Hey, that was easy.
You forgot habeas corpus.
Enough. Your credentials are accepted.
Peace out.
Defense makes a lot difference. Utah beat Houston on defense. San Antonio beats Phoenix on defense. New Orleans destroyed Dallas because Dallas do not have defense and New Orleans knows how to defend. Lakers beat Denver because Denver do not have defense.
If the Warriors want to reach playoff we better get new players to play defense. Perhaps we should pay more to the players that play defense than the ones that do not play defense.
Finally, great teams play better defense on the fourth quarter and the result is a W.
So, what, are we going to spend here the next 6 months discussing Warriors roster moves? Yaaaaawwwwwn.
Give the dubs a break for a while. There’s plenty of other great hoops to watch.
Hey, did you see the first two games in the Spurs-Suns series? Awesome!
The best teams are playing some amazing basketball while we debate the virtues of POB. That’s very sad.
Passion Man— How about Chris Paul, 32 pts + 17 assists! Wish Baron could learn that you can score points AND help your teammates too.
50–James Online
You have a very unique perspective. AB and Rodman. Never thought of AB that way before but I see what you mean. You bring some much needed fresh new ideas to the discussions here. I hope you keep posting.
Oracle/Chuck C #75
Stick with making dubious basketball points.
get rid of chroshere. 2nd round pick: joey dorsey. defensive machine who can run. thats all i need to say.
78. Passion Man,
Agree.
Chris Paul is amazing. I can’t wait to see what happens against a big team like Utah.
Spurs-Suns series is great but I hate seeing the Suns lose. I really want them to beat the Spurs. Gotta give it to the Spurs though. We’ll see what happens in Phoenix.